Investment Thread

Discussion in 'General Chat' started by huntingground, Apr 22, 2020.

  1. jj1981

    jj1981 Competitor

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    Yes it will drop and rise, I have it physical instead of safed , but when the banks go tips up watch it rise again like a few years ago and tbh it doesn't drop that much that there's gonna be a loss.

    The weight of gold and silver is a better investment than gambling on potential huge loss on stocks etc
     
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  2. noel

    noel Moderator

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    But gold crashed before too. Remember when Gordon brown was chancellor and sold out gold at record lows. I’m fully aware of the potential as a hedge I mean it’s my job. It’s what I do I’m just pointing out it’s not risk free. Plus it only offers growth potential not income therefore it’s generally not a great investment apart from purely as a risk hedge. Even then we all assume gold would be worth something if the world collapsed. No guarantee that would actually be the case either. A stock market index tracked bought on the lows we just saw would have performed very well and over time generally does. Gold stock owners outperform the holders of physical metals and longer term both bonds and stocks outperform gold. Stocks by some Considerable margin
     
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  3. Guest82

    Guest82 Guest

    Roger, swampy
     
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  4. huntingground

    huntingground Kenstradamus Competitor

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    The chance of losing massively on the oil super majors is very small. Look at the historical graphs, yes there are peaks and troughs but that is what investing in stocks is about, buy at bottom, sell at top.

    Screenshot 2020-06-04 at 06.27.28.png

    Screenshot 2020-06-04 at 06.27.49.png
     
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  5. TONY FERGUSON

    TONY FERGUSON Winging my way to heaven as we speak, son. Full Member

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    Why would I trust you when the only experience you have had is working next to the "carbon tradition desk"? (whatever the fuck that is.)

    I think I will settle for offsetting my carbon with programmes which have nothing to do with "the very companies" I hate, and I'll feel really good about it, because it's my very company which runs the programmes!

    There you go, yet another reason for you to be salty AF! Hahahahaha!!
     
  6. TONY FERGUSON

    TONY FERGUSON Winging my way to heaven as we speak, son. Full Member

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    I'll try and explain this to you in simple terms so that you get it. Yes, solar panels and electric cars to have a carbon footprint. Hell, even breathing air has a carbon footprint.

    But here's the thing: we know how much that carbon footprint is and we only need to worry about it at the beginning and end of the products' life-cycle, as opposed to the alternatives which we need to worry about around the clock.

    For electric cars, you don't need to worry every time you fill up with gas or stick some oil in the sump, because these are things that you won't ever need to do.

    For solar panels, you don't need to worry about burning dirty fuels to generate your electricity, because again, this is something you won't ever need to do.

    And the idea is, if we can switch over to using these things exclusively, then we'll have reduced emissions enough to avoid the most harmful impacts of man-made climate change.

    You see, there is nothing wrong with a little bit of unavoidable emission which comes about from the manufacture of these goods-the planet can deal with a little bit of emissions, after all. It's the constant churning out out emissions which come about from our energy demands that does the lion's share of the damage. That's why we're simply aiming for carbon reductions and that's why electric cars and solar panels are the closest thing to a perfect solution we have (as of now) to ensure we will be able to meet those targets. So you literally couldn't have chosen two worse examples to make your point!

    I'll bet you also chastise vegans because harvesting vegetables kills insects. Or doctors because they also die of maladies. If that's your philosophical approach to life, then more power to you.

    Let me know how that works out for you.
     
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  7. huntingground

    huntingground Kenstradamus Competitor

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    @noel PIF (Saubi Arabian's sovereign wealth fund) was hoovering up oil stocks in March, then agreed to a cut in production in April.

    Nice work!!
     
  8. huntingground

    huntingground Kenstradamus Competitor

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    Just worked out that this quarter, I'll be getting £200 in dividends (Shell dividend cut) so will reinvest all dividends into the stock each quarter.
     
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  9. Richard Dick

    Richard Dick Full Member

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    So it's ok to be responsible for polluting the environment if you only do it on a intermittent basis, but not ok if it's ongoing? So it's ok for you to have a carbon footprint 20 times larger than a guy in pakistan, because your tesla, solar panels etc aren't burning oil like his 50cc moped?

    You don't have a leg to stand on. Typical delusional hypocrite. Like the celebrities that fly on private jets but then make some donation to a carbon offsetting scheme that somehow makes it ok.
     
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  10. TONY FERGUSON

    TONY FERGUSON Winging my way to heaven as we speak, son. Full Member

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    You're either completely clueless or think that your incessant replies are somehow making up for the amount of times I've owned you in this discussion.

    In your defence, I like to think it's the latter, primarily because I don't believe anybody can be this stupid.

    Either way, I've made my points quite clear and hopefully those who aren't as clueless or butthurt can see where I'm coming from with the whole carbon reduction thing.

    But don't let me stop you and your poverty analogies. You're making this thread a little more entertaining at least.
     
  11. Richard Dick

    Richard Dick Full Member

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    So in other words you've ran out of argument? Thanks for playing, princess.
     
  12. noel

    noel Moderator

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    My first trading job was used to trade oil / petchems at the worlds largest (At the time) energy trading company. How’s that for experience So sitting next to people who trade carbon credits and being trained on how the various things work gives me a heads up I would say - I can safely vouch they are just a made up pointless derivative. Handed out by governments and then traded between companies. Environmental impact. Nada. Not salty at all. I guess your involved in stuff like replanting trees or recycling stuff. Good for you doing your bit. Maybe one day we will be able to use something better But until China and India play ball with emissions. The Brazilians Indonesians/Malays stop chopping down their rainforest. The yanks not being reliant on oil it’s a tall ask right now. Might see some small nations doing stuff but That’s it.
     
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  13. TONY FERGUSON

    TONY FERGUSON Winging my way to heaven as we speak, son. Full Member

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    What's the point in continuing to debate with somebody who's clearly salty AF for being owned time and again and refuses to take any of my valid points on board by pretending he doesn't hear them?

    Rehashing old arguments which have been refuted don't make you a persistent debater, but rather a persistent pain in the arse.

    If you're after the hollow victory, then well done. You're an indefatigable pain in the arse and I'm sure they're plenty of wankers out there who would give you a pat on the back. But I wasn't playing. I genuinely thought I could talk some sense into a retard.

    Guess you're more retarded than I thought.
     
  14. TONY FERGUSON

    TONY FERGUSON Winging my way to heaven as we speak, son. Full Member

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    Sorry to say, and please don't take this the wrong way, but I don't believe that sitting next to somebody who works/worked in this industry gives you a heads up, much less make you an authority on the matter. Especially when you just admitted that your actual job was trading petrochemicals. I've always found those guys to have been trained up in a way biased towards the petrochemical industry and largely oblivious to what carbon trading is all about.

    And when I read your post, I'm thinking to myself that you were working there a good few years ago? Reason why I ask that is because you seem to be harking back to an era in which yes, absolutely, I'll be the first to admit was hugely open to manipulation and very frequently was with some sketchy CDI and JI schemes and mechanisms par the course. But come on, man, that was years ago and now they're plenty of decentralised and verifiable platforms which have absolutely nothing to do with governments and you can literally log in at any given time to see exactly how much positive environmental impact they are having.

    And in any event the dodgy mechanisms you're talking about will largely be defunct after this year when they have to comply by the EU ETS emission allowances. So please don't be deterred just because there were a few bad apples in there and please appreciate that you perhaps weren't sold the bigger picture.

    I'm with you on the whole China, India etc. having to play ball part. But that doesn't mean that we should stop trying.

    And here's the analogy I would give you. You talking about flying in planes... is this something we would ever have been able to do if we simply gave up after looking at the batshit early incarnations of flight? It must have looked pretty hopeless back then watching people gluing wings on their backs and falling to their deaths, but that didn't deter people and neither should we today be deterred by past mistakes made in the carbon trading industry.

    To solve problems requires persistence and plenty of getting things wrong. I think it was Edison who said something like in order to invent the lightbulb he had to figure out 1000 ways how not to invent one.

    Failure is one step closer to a solution.
     
  15. GhostOf2Can

    GhostOf2Can Top Contributor

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    Tony Ferguson has been on an extended fishing trip since joining the forum on Sunday

    And he’s been very successful

    Had a lot of big time financial powerhouse tiddlers jumping in to his net non-stop

    Absolutely tremendous angling