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Introduction to natural GH release and GHRH/GHRPs

Discussion in 'Growth Hormone/Peptides' started by Max, Mar 25, 2011.

  1. forddee

    forddee Full Member

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    At the time i did my home work on MGF ,the main view on its use was doing 500mcg 2x per week shot bie/lat the day before a large muscle group was trained .As said i did on non training days but at a lower dose ,just to see what it was like for me .After doing it now i think i will just stick to igf as said . Daz
     
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  2. forddee

    forddee Full Member

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    All good with G6/cjc use atm i have dropped some IGF-Des in the mix now and growing like a mushroom lol.
    I will add that Long acting slin will be dropped next time its on the list due to fat gain from it ,its a mind game with a good fuller feel and shape but that belly is taking the shape away a little.

    Also in inj DHEA @50mg per 1ml i tried this some years ago and got some in Wallmart in the US this year so when test is stopped i will drop this baby in .

    Daz

    Daz
     
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  3. hackskii

    hackskii Full Member

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    DHEA can bump up estrogen levels, I think 25mg would be better.
     
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  4. ricky23

    ricky23 Top Contributor

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    this was posted by datbtrue on another forum
    copied and pasted it as i found it very helpful and very well written

    Some terms:

    Natural GH is a blend of isoforms. Two of those forms are equally anabolic. One makes up the majority of natural GH release, weighs 22kda and is 191 amino acids long. The other weighs 20kda and has the 15 amino acids that interact with the prolactin receptor removed. The pharmaceutical companies chose to use the 22kda form for their drug. Noone makes a 20kda form.

    In addition nature stacks these forms so you get 22kda:22kda; 22kda:20kda; 20kda:20kda stacks. Noone exactly knows why. There are also some naturally occurring fragments that are released.

    Synthetic GH is simply the 22kda form chosen by the drug companies.

    Pulsatile release of natural GH is achieved by the hypothalamus (area of the brain) releasing the hormone GHRH (growth hormone releasing hormone) into the the pituitary where it binds to cells in the pituitary and causes the release of stores of GH isoforms to be released.

    Now the cells network and coordinated this release. They actually communicate and send a strong squirt of GH into the blood stream.

    The hypothalamus also creates a hormone called somatostatin which also binds to cells in the pituitary and shuts off GH release. This on/off interplay creates pulses and when we have "off" time the cells are quickly remaking GH from pieces it keeps lying around so that it is ready to release the next time GHRH comes calling.

    There is a third hormone called Ghrelin which comes from the gut and is a modulating hormone. It also binds to the pituitary and increases GHRH's positive effect and reduces Somatostatin's negative effect. The artificial mickers of Ghrelin are the GHRPs (growth hormone releasing peptides).

    GHRH if injected only has a really positive effect on GH release if naturally occurring somatostin isn't currently active. We have no real way of knowing though...

    GHRH works well in our bodies because it travels such a short distnce and is then used but if you inject it, it breaks down quickly (in minutes) and so analogs were created to resist this.

    The primary analog has 4 amino acids replaced so it increases the half-life to 30 minutes. This is often called tetra-substituted (4-sub) but it is what I refer to as modified GRF(1-29). A lot of people mistakenly call it CJC-1295.

    So if you inject modified GRF(1-29) you are happy because it will survive... it is a better form of GHRH BUT again if somatostatin is currently active then the GH pulse will not be strong.

    GHRPs, are needed to create a pulse. GHRPs come in several forms. GHRP-6, GHRP-2 and Hexarelin. All work the same way. The GHRPs blunt somatostatin and increase natural GHRH release. So if you inject a GHRP you create a pulse of GH which rises for 30 minutes, peaks and comes down within 2 hours. That mimics a natural pulse.

    So THAT is the time to take your modified GRF(1-29) (a better form of GHRH) because it will now work since somatostin isn't around.

    The studies find synergy between these two peptides. Together they create a strong pulse of GH.

    Growth Hormone Receptors, reside primarily on cells in the liver and they await the ligand GH. Now a strong pulse will send GH in mass so that a bunch binds at the same time to these receptors. When GH binds to a receptor it switches on a few events. One of those events is activating the Stat5b protein or intracellular pathway. This protein when activated moves to the nucleus of the cell and initiates transcription of proteins among them IGF-1.

    Stat5b needs time off and it is strongly activated after it gets a break.

    Synthetic GH administration, can occur intravenously. This allows for GH to mimic a pulse by immediately hitting the blood stream. binding to receptors and then even at high doses (20iu+) it is out within 2 hours.

    The other two forms intramuscularly and subcutaneously result in slower release profiles. The primary reason is that the molecule is large.

    So if you dose more then 4iu subcutaneously the release profile looks like an elevation more then a pulse and it starts to last for 3,4+ hours.

    Pulsing synthetic GH can be achieved by choosing 2iu, 3iu or 4iu (keep in mind intramuscular has a little faster release rate) and dosing so as to get a 2 hour rise followed by a 3 hour off time. This can be done 4 times a day or 5 times if you dose in the middle of the night.

    Some people prefer 2iu and squeeze in 6 doses in a 24 hour period. This is obviously an extreme way to do it but welcome to bodybuilding...

    Pulsing with GHRH/GHRPs - you can dose 250mcg of a GHRP (i.e. GHRP-6, GHRP-2 or Hexarelin) with 100mcg+ of modified GRF(1-29).

    100mcg of each is a minimal clinical dose but doses as high as 400mcg at a time have some effect.

    Obviously these peptides create pulses and no amount will interfere so dosing can be whatever.

    For instance a lady who is about 65 uses a tiny amount pre-bed (maybe 25mcg of each). She was crippled with bone pain and had to crawl up stairs. Prescription GH was of limited effect. The mod GRF(1-29)/GHRP-6 changed her life immediately. Now 6 months later she walks 2 miles a day and even breaks into a jog when pushing the grandkids stroller. Her doctor says her bone density is that of a young person. This is just an illustration... and for bodybuilding her dosing is not sufficient...

    The key though is to remind yourself that GH is just a communicative tool. It communicates different things depending on how it is released... it has zero value except for its role as a communicator.

    You use the GHRH/GHRP every time you want a pulse. You ALWAYS want one pre-bed. In men the biggest amount of GH release occurs at night. GH release and slow wave sleep are positively correlated. You increase/decrease one you increase/decrease the other. These peptides really increase deep restful sleep and I have been told by many that this alone is worth it.

    It takes just 100mcg of each to get this deeper sleep.

    You also want to dose PWO and in the morning. That is 3 times a day. You can go as many as 6 times a day (people do... they are a bit obsessive ).

    Combining synthetic GH and GHRH/GHRPs - The GHRH/GHRPs are know to act quicker then synthetic GH. By act I mean engage lipolysis if you are keeping insulin quiet and active enough to burn mobilized fatty acids but also strengthening connective tissue.

    I just wrote an article for Big A's whey protein product as an excuse to talk about what specific aspects, insulin, GH, IGF-1, IGF-1/BP3, androgens, blood flow, amino acid pool, thyroid hormones contribute towards protein metabolism.

    GH greatly contributes to decreasing muscle protein breakdown and preventing Leucine from being oxidized. I REALLY wanted people to see how these things work together and understand that growth hormone is not anabolic by itself but with insulin (which increases muscle protein synthesis) it is anabolic. It increases amino acid transport into muscle so insulin increased muscle protein synthesis will have a substrate to work with.

    So the GHRH/GHRPs work a little faster but you are limited to whatever available stores of GH you have to create a pulse. To get a higher pulse you add synthetic GH which is also now part of a natural blend.

    You would administer the GHRH/GHRP...let that pulse start going and 10 minutes later administer 2iu to 4iu of synthetic GH. That will create the biggest super-natural pulse that you can achieve and the body will see it as a big "natural" pulse.

    You can repeat this.

    Every day is effective. The reason EOD worked better then ED was because when you dose 12iu+ you need time off... think those graphs I referred you to.

    [​IMG]

    With 4iu of synthetic GH and tapping out your natural stores you will saturate receptors pretty well.

    Insulin will increase GH receptors as well at low dose but at 8iu the benefit goes back to zero... this doesn't by any means mean you need to hold insulin below 8iu... it is just one of many many effects of insulin... and I just note it.

    Then after 5 hours you can do this again and then again. That is a far better way to use 12iu a day and with your own natural release you may end up above 20iu.
     
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  5. forddee

    forddee Full Member

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    More base info ,top job @ricky23...

    @IGF-DES
    I have mainly been doing 50mcg bei /lat and
    did tri's yesterday and did 100mcg in each tri and very full tris now ,but is it now growth or local swelling from shot ,show time will tell me or as a lower BF% is reached.


    Daz
     
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  6. forddee

    forddee Full Member

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    IGF-DES

    All is going well with IGF-DES ,I am run it @100mcg bie-lat shots fullness from this med is great and I am coming to the end of slin use so will keep an eye on fullness .
    I still feel that IGF-DES and from IGF-LR3 ,the gains creep up on you over time ,once i have come off all meds and test in put back in bang!! new muscle growth has been filled.

    Daz
     
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  7. domeniko

    domeniko Banned

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    fantastic informations
     
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  8. Ironworks

    Ironworks Meat Puppet Full Member

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    Wow this stuff is blowing me away. I'm having enough difficulty getting decent HGH let alone peptides.
    Anyone got any idea how this information could be useful for someone post surgery? Bankart repair.
    I know HGH is decent in this regard used in an eod fashion and has helped me maintain some of my mass.
    This stuff sounds much easier to get wrong
     
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  9. Goose

    Goose Top Contributor

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    Hows the pep use coming along, any further updates? interesting read!
     
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  10. forddee

    forddee Full Member

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    How time flys , i have not been around much due to family life and work and all that .
    I will be stepping on stage next month and will see how much mass has been gained for when my back was put out last year . And how much of a step they was on my mass gained.
    I would say that i should of run peps more but cash held me back here aswell so after blasting them i stuck with Test @50mg-1g PW and have made good gains ,so show pics will tell .

    Daz
     
    #55
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  11. muscleup1975

    muscleup1975

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    GHRP's simply activate the anterior pituitary gland causing the door to open if you like, I don't believe it stimulates the gland to produce more GH, but in theory if its emptying I suppose it would try to make more? The hypothalamus stimulates the gland normally, when we wake and sleep etc according to our sleep patterns.

    If you use MOD GRF or CJC DAC, then you are actually taking the first section of the GH chain, this section from 1-29 is the part responsible for cellar repair, so the bit that makes us grow. Of course you can just use products that are further down the pathway.

    GH becomes MGF eventually, you can buy these splices and variants, MGF has to be used locally as it cannot travel the blood stream. Pegylated MGF however can, then you have IGF-1 DES, very anabolic, locally used, then IGF-1 LR3, can travel the bloodstream, these are not GHRP's.

    Highly recommend IGF-1 LR3 and PEG MGF. However CJC DAC used correctly is awesome, but head aches have been reported, but then we get head aches anyway dont we, and when we are on a drug we blame the drug!

    CJC DAC 7 day half life, so, take 4mg the first week, then the next 11 weeks take 2mg, this will keep your system topped up to 4mg on average for 12 weeks, then a break should be taken.
     
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  12. noel

    noel Moderator

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    just use real HGH works miles better
     
    #58
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